About this episode
New York City’s mayor called them “public enemy number one.” History books say they caused the Black Death — although recent scientific evidence disputes that claim. In an updated episode from 2025, we ask: Is the rat a scapegoat? And what does our rat hatred say about us? SOURCES: Bethany Brookshire , author of Pests: How Humans Create Animal Villains. Kathy Corradi , senior vice president of resident services, partnerships, and initiatives at the New York City Housing Authority. Ed Glaeser , professor of economics at Harvard University. Nils Stenseth , professor of ecology and evolution at the University of Oslo. RESOURCES: " On Patrol With the Rat Czar, " by Mark Chiusano (Intelligencer, 2024). " How Rats Took Over North America, " by Allison Parshall (Scientific American, 2024). " Where Are the Rats in New York City, " by Matt Yan (New York Times, 2024). Pests: How Humans Create Animal Villains by Bethany Brookshire (2022). " Human ectoparasites and the spread of plague in Europe during the Second Pandemic, " by Nils Stenseth, Katharine Dean, Fabienne Krauer, Lars Walløe, Ole Christian Lingjærde, Barbara Bramanti, and Boris Schmid (Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, 2018). EXTRAS: " Freakonomics Radio Live: 'Jesus Could Have Been a Pigeon.' " by Freakonomics Radio (2018). Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.